Reliving the Magic: Freddie Banks on the 1987 UNLV Rebels’ Breathtaking Journey to the Final Four

Get ready for a whirlwind journey back to 1987 with the UNLV Run-and-Rebels basketball team. We're joined by none other than Freddie Banks, a key player in that iconic Final Four team. Freddie brings to life the remarkable camaraderie, electrifying offense, and underrated defense that made the team truly legendary. He opens up about his personal journey, why he chose to play for his local school, and spills the secrets on Coach Jerry Tarkanian’s game-changing, laid-back coaching style.

Buckle up as we delve into the innovative strategies of Coach Jerry Tarkanian. A style that gave players a rare kind of freedom on the court, and led to a kind of basketball magic that took the team to extraordinary heights. We explore fascinating stories around the team's recruitment process, including a home visit from the one and only Frank Sinatra, and a peculiar scholarship strategy for a recruit in a correctional facility. 

The climax of our tale takes us to the team's journey to the Final Four. Freddie shares vivid memories of the NCAA tournament, including the remarkable comeback against the Iowa Hawkeyes and the intense locker room atmosphere post a hard-fought loss to Indiana. This isn’t just an in-depth look at the history of UNLV basketball, it’s a celebration of the sport in its purest form. So, join us as we ride the rollercoaster of the 1987 UNLV Run-and-Rebels.

Chapters

• 10:04 UNLV Basketball's Creative Freedom and Force
• 21:37 Freddie Banks' Journey and Nickname
• 27:12 UNLV Basketball Team and Final Four
• 37:03 Memories of a Final Four Run
• 44:21 Post-Game Reflections on UNLV Basketball
• 50:10 1987 UNLV Running Rebels Retrospective

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:17

Welcome to Episode 6 of Iconic Season 1987, the year that saw one of the most iconic matchups in NCAA basketball history. On today's episode we're going to be telling the story of the UNLV run-and-rebels. We also have an interview with Freddie Banks, one of the players from that Final Four team. If you're a fan of UNLV or basketball, you don't want to miss this episode. Tune in and, if you like it, leave us a rating and or review. This is Episode 6 of Iconic Season 1987. Las Vegas, for some reason, and I don't know why, seems to forget about the 1987 team. As our guest will tell you, the players in the 1987 team are still close and frequently exchange phone calls or text messages, despite living in different cities. One of his teammates commented at a reunion we're a bunch of knuckleheads who just loved each other. I tell everyone we were the 12 Stooges. It was that kind of camaraderie that made them successful. They averaged 92.6 points per game in the tournament, which was the most of any team. They shot 50.4% from the field and 40% from 3-point range in the tournament. They had 5 players who averaged double-digit points in the tournament 3 banks at 38 points per game. Gerald Patio at 16.3,. Jarvis Bass Knight 12.3, Eldridge Hudson 12 and Armand Gilliam at 10. But let's start the storytelling here. Jerry Tarkanian, Tark the Shark Two things how good and how entertaining his UNLV basketball teams were. The running rebels of Tarkanian played it the way it should have been played, with an aggressive, up-tempo offense and with defense that was highly underrated. Really, scoring a lot of points isn't how it's done. It's doing that combined with going at it hard on the defensive end. It's what can happen when a team is coached extremely well but isn't over-coached. It's what can happen when a coach trusts in players who can play. 

Speaker 2: 2:17

He gets up in the morning and he thinks basketball. And then he has lunch and he thinks basketball. 

Speaker 3: 2:24

You gotta give 100%, not 90. He has dinner and he talks basketball. 

Speaker 4: 2:28

He could be taking the salt and pepper shakers and the little sugar packets. You know doing plays. 

Speaker 2: 2:34

And after dinner he goes home and he watches basketball. And then he gets up the next morning and he coaches basketball. He's the most one-dimensional man in the world. 

Speaker 1: 2:41

Let's talk about some UNLV recruiting. This often gets highlighted, but it's true, because Tark took a different pathway. He was willing to take risks in a place that hadn't had a successful basketball team. He had a vision for why players had a right to be at the college level and he had a vision for how to help players who came from underserved or underprivileged areas of the country or from situations that were overlooked or swept under the rug. Tark may have more recruiting stories than anyone ever. 

Speaker 5: 3:11

Old blue eyes proved to be a better singer than a recruiter, but his willingness to be Tarkanian's messenger spoke loudly about how high this unlikely star had risen. Even in a town full of world-renowned entertainers, one stood out, an affable coach with a trademark towel, known as Tark the Shark. 

Speaker 6: 3:34

I think they're a great team and I'm very delighted for them, except Tarkanian is eating up all the linen. The man sits on the bench and eats towels. 

Speaker 7: 3:40

He always looks so sad. He's chewing on his towel and he looks like a bulldog or something. 

Speaker 1: 3:46

There was a time when he sent Frank Sinatra in on a home visit in New Jersey because the recruit had an Italian mother. It didn't work. There was another time that he picked up a recruit after school in Brooklyn for weeks on end to drive him to his girlfriend's house and then wait outside in his car as they got reacquainted. That one worked. There was a time he planned on stashing a recruit at a cabin in Lake Arrowhead, california, until Siding Day, only to find out that someone else had stashed him on Waikake Beach. There was a time when he learned that it always pays to get the high school girlfriend to come along too, at least for the first semester. There was another time when he sprinted out of a home visit with a mother because he thought the NCAA had bugged the joint. To appreciate Jerry Tarkanian in his full glory, you need to know about the time he signed Allen to a letter of intent. Unlv had a new president, robert Maxon, who was trying to improve the academic profile. Unlv was a growing commuter school and was trying to shake off the mobster era reputation of Old Vegas. 

Speaker 8: 4:45

People seem to have trouble imagining a real university in the shadow of the strip. 

Speaker 3: 4:51

So what made you want to take Kingsley's course? You know it's the toughest one on this campus. 

Speaker 6: 4:55

The toughest course at UNLV, and that's saying something. 

Speaker 3: 5:00

Tell me about it. Every course at UNLV is a killer. 

Speaker 5: 5:04

This class is the principles of Blackjack 1. 

Speaker 1: 5:09

Tark realized that if Allen was on an academic scholarship, it freed up one more basketball scholarship to bring in another guy. Plus, they could publicize it and it would help Allen's reputation win-win. An assistant was dispatched to the youth correctional facility and an official paper was drafted. A couple of bucks may or may not have been used to grease the skids with a dumbfounded prison worker. However, it was done. Allen was declared the valedictorian of the prison GED program, even if no one knew if a prison GED program could even have a valedictorian, because you know, it's a prison GED program. So what happened? A week before the meeting? Allen boosted a car and got sent back in. Tarkanian said he lost his prize. Big man, yes, tark cracked, but I could always say that I recruited the valedictorian. You can see where Tark was ahead of his time and also why Saturday Night Live jumped into parody. Unlv College basketball is a lot more fun when it embraces the characters that weren't any more colorful than Jerry Tarkanian, who absolutely never fit in with the conservative culture of the sport at the time, the media that covered it or the NCAA that ruled it. Let's talk about the team. The effort, said Tarkanian, is incredible. Well, the big effort didn't bring the running rebels their first NCAA title. The torrid pace with an accelerated offense and pressuring defense was able to hide its defects and get it oh so close to that goal. 

Speaker 9: 6:30

With his style of up tempo, was more of an organized chaos. People thought that we wasn't organized, but we worked our tails off to make sure we played together and were then same with each other. 

Speaker 3: 6:43

You create the way you're going to play and because of that I never had more than one or two defenses. I usually only had one defense and maybe a second one for a little bit. But we did the same things over and over and over in practice to create the habit and everything had to be intense. Everything was full speed, intense and I wanted guys intense. I know a lot of coaches want their guys loose. I never wanted my guys loose. I wanted their hands sweating. I wanted their knees shaking. I want their eyes bulging. I wanted to feel like we're getting ready to go to war. I never wanted my guys relaxed. I had a transfer one year from USC and he said, coach, he says, uh, do we have some music in before the game? I had no talking in the locker room. I had total silence. He said that no talking makes me nervous. I said I said it's no different in the summertime. Some guy comes to your hometown and says, hey, I'm going to come over to your house at two o'clock and I'm going to kick your butt. And I said what are you going to do? You're going to turn your music on or you're going to get intense. 

Speaker 1: 7:48

The UNLV was not overpowering, which in a tournament adds pressure to the artistic rather than the physical team. Their offense relied a lot on three pointers. There is as well their unsettling habit of falling far behind early in the game, requiring a cavalry charge at the finish. In the coaches scheme of things, hard work is the measuring rod. When teams of his win but do not give their best effort, he takes it personally, so much so that he's canceled postseason banquets for teams that did not work hard enough to suit him. I gave him a banquet and I told him why, said Tarkanian, the one thing I want is that they work hard and play hard. At UNLV, player status rises and falls on sustained effort. Take Jarvis Bassnite, a junior who came to Las Vegas from Mount San Antonio College, a junior college apparently without the code of conduct Tarkanian expects. When Bassnite would complain of cold or sore ribs and let it affect his effort, tarkanian marked him as a guy who did not want to play badly enough. I couldn't question. Was he really hurt or sick, said Tarkanian. That'd be like questioning his manhood. The only thing I could do was to not play him, because guys are hurt all the time and go ahead and play hard. When Tarkanian saw Bassnite in his words, busting his tail, bassnite became the starter, called JB or the beaster by his teammates. Bassnite has learned to fit in his role that serves his team. There's long arms and quickness. Bassnite was effective in his helter, skelter, full court man to man pressure defense the running rebels used extensively in this season. Mark Wade, a 511 left-hander, started his college career at the University of Oklahoma where he was, as he said, at the wrong place at the wrong time. They had, wade said, a senior point guard, and the coach's son, tommy Tubbs, playing ahead of me. This was not what Wade had anticipated. I was expecting to play right away, said when he got to Las Vegas. It took him a while for coach Tarkanian to feel comfortable with him running the team. Wade said it goes back to the height factor. As long as I've been playing, I've heard from a lot of coaches. They want big point guards. But his playmaking knack became Wade's calling card. He became known as the disher. He concentrated so much on passing the teams began dropping Wade's defender into the fall lane, double-teaming Armand Gilliam, the team's top scorer. Wade and several other teammates commented that the tour they took to Tahiti, australia and New Zealand really helped the team On that tour before the season. Tarkanian allowed players to operate with more freedom. What resulted was that Wade and other players showed Tarkanian that they could operate one on one without the system going up in smoke. As a result, tarkanian gave his players a more creative license, which the player said benefited their offense. It certainly helped Wade, who, tarkanian, gave the green light to shoot whenever he wanted. Everyone giggled about that. Wade commented because they know I don't like to shoot. However, against New Mexico State on February 21st, when UNLV trailed by 17.5, wade nailed three three-pointers to start the rally that resulted in an 80-69 victory. That show of offensive force was out of character. He's usually content to deliver the ball to Gilliam and the three-point bombers Freddie Banks and Gerald Patio. Early on, banks won the nickname Fearless Freddie for his habit of sinking long-range shots with the outcome of the games on the line. 

Speaker 10: 10:58

Freddie was a great competitor. He was a guy that was full of confidence. 

Speaker 3: 11:02

I would get a hand right in his face every single time and you could look in his eyes and he'd never lost concentration of basketball. I call him Fearless Fred, never afraid to take this shot. Freddie Banks for three Banks, that's a three-pointer. 

Speaker 11: 11:17

My high school coach basically told me how to go to the elbow shot and that's right into free throw line and shoot that, and then I kind of moved myself back. Father and father, my arm was getting a little bit stronger and stronger and that's why I got the name of Fearless Freddie. 

Speaker 3: 11:33

He had more tough shots than anybody I've ever seen. When the games on the line Freddie's going to hit it. 

Speaker 1: 11:38

This is one of six seniors and is still undaunted by shooting under pressure. Of the starters, banks, who is from Las Vegas, is the only one who is recruited by UNLV directly from high school. The others arrived via the junior college pipeline. The last piece of the puzzle was Patio, who was recruited during the spring out of Seminole Junior College. Patio was like a designated shooter. Because of his deficiencies as a passer and dribbler, he was not the beneficiary of Tarcanian's Lazai fare approach. For Patio, the dribble was considered too much of an adventure and he was encouraged to stick to the three-point line. The most trusted starter was Armand Gilliam, who had a soft jumper and enough power moves to encourage visits to the Thomson Max Center by NBA scouts. Gilliam was a former football player who switched to basketball in the 11th grade. He was the son of a clergyman and was soft-spoken but didn't back down from confrontation. Gilliam established his reputation and his nickname as the hammer in his first season with the Running Rebels. The setting was a local nightclub where a large UNLV football player threatened a 5'9 reserve guard on the basketball team. Gilliam took the situation and the football player into hand. Since then, unlv has looked at him in tight spots on the court as well. Wade says Armand is the man. 

Speaker 3: 12:53

My assistant spotted his talent. In fact, armand's first college game that he's eligible I don't play him the whole game a week at B by the middle of the year Armand's our best player. They call him the hammer. 

Speaker 7: 13:05

Armand Gilliam was like a he-man. He was the hammer when he got the ball. But he had hands like an angel. It's like he covered them in basketball lotion before every game and he had just the softest little shot. Gilliam yes, the big guy, gilliam Down low, he has the softest hands of any big man in the country. 

Speaker 10: 13:27

Once I got it down, my offense really came into its own when I started scoring a lot of points and by my senior year it was pretty easy for me to score points. Wade, Gilliam, we were winning games pretty handily. I've done a lot of games for the Rebels folks. I've never seen him any hotter than this. I don't get more than any colder 33 to 6. 

Speaker 11: 13:42

20, 30 point victories for most of that season. I knew we had something special. 

Speaker 10: 13:54

We wanted to take it as far as it would go. 

Speaker 1: 13:56

Again. I want to come back and talk a little more about that tour and what some of the players said Last night said during that tour we were talking about the season to come and we said we're going to the Final Four. No team is going to beat us After Australia. Wherever we went, whoever we played, they had no chance to beat us. Any team that got in front of us we'd bust their ass. It was that type of mentality that gave the players the confidence they were not going to be denied. Alder Tudson said we weren't cocky but we always knew we were going to win. I can't put into words how special that team was. We were never rattled. You have to understand the history of the program. We were a bunch of inner city kids and had that mentality that nobody was going to mess with us or beat us. Unlv was a school of hard-nosed kids and we looked out for each other. The 1987 team reached the Final Four in New Orleans. Banks set that record by making 10-3 pointers. 

Speaker 7: 14:49

I just couldn't believe that our local college was going for the national championship. It seemed so big to me, like a kid on your block fighting for the heavyweight title. 

Speaker 5: 14:59

So it is night against Tarkanian and the London Rebels at 37-1 are favored by four. 

Speaker 1: 15:06

They lost just two games that year by combining five points and helped pave the way for the program's future success. To this day, the players don't consider that 88-89 loss at Oklahoma as a defeat because of a disputed bucket before halftime that was incorrectly ruled two points instead of three. They finished with the most magical moment of the season the defeat of Iowa to reach the Final Four. 

Speaker 6: 15:28

Bill, it strikes me that we've seen the top seed go down in two games yesterday. Is there a chance that top seeded UNLV could lose today? Absolutely, and Jerry Tarkanian scared to death when he has to face that trap of Iowa. He hasn't seen that trap for a year and a half now and the last time they saw it was against Tom Davis when he was at Stanford. So it's going to be very interesting to see how they attack it. 

Speaker 1: 15:50

Tarkanian said losing would have been a disappointment, but the prospect of being routed would have stung long after the season. The UNLV coach was well aware of the doubts and the critics about his team. The running Rebels play in a weak conference. They're undisciplined and will invariably end their season somewhere short of the Final Four. But UNLV kept a furious second half comeback with an 84-81 victory against Iowa. The Rebels trailed by 16 points after the first half and as many as 18 before they began their rush to victory. We weren't getting beat. We weren't getting humiliated, Tarkanian said At halftime. We face the fact that the season would pretty much be over in 20 minutes, but these kids have courage. We just decided to go out and play like the running Rebels. Tarkanian blamed himself for the first half performance, saying that he implemented a switching defense to help compensate for Iowa's height advantage. His aim was to keep his small team from facing too many mismatches inside. He confused the Rebels instead, he said, nullifying the pressure they would put on opponents. Iowa scored baskets as if it were practicing and on offense UNLV was missing three-point shots that had become its trademark this season. They hit just four of 17. The outlook was bleak. I just never feel that we can't come back, though, said Gary Graham, whose two free throws with 10 seconds left sealed the victory At halftime. We were so loose, I didn't care if we were down 20,. Back to man to man. There was no secret strategies to unveil in the second half, no new Rockney type speech to inspire the players. Tarcanian simply told them to return to their man to man, pressure defense and keep taking the shots that helped them to win 36 of 37 games, One victory short of the NCAA record set by Duke the previous year. His message was especially intended for Gerald Patio, the lanky forward whose specialty was a three point shot and had been slumping in the last month of the season, missing all five of his three pointers in the first half. But I knew that it was either I was going to start making that shot or we're gonna lose the game, he said. I said that I was gonna come back and do the best I could. Patio found the range early in the second half, hitting a three pointer to cut. I was lead to 64-52. From that point on, the lead melted like a stick of butter. Unlv scored 10 consecutive points and 14 more after Brad Lohas of the Hawkeyes interrupted the comeback with a layup. Patio had nine of those 14 points in the second streak all three point baskets. Unlv made 11 of 30 overall. With a little more than eight minutes to play, UNLV had charged to a 71-66 lead. We knew at halftime. It was far from over, said Tom Davis, the Iowa coach. When you have two running teams playing you'll see bigger shifts in the momentum. They just did everything better than we did in the second half. The smaller Rebels even out-rebounded Iowa in the second half and finished the game even in that department. The Hawkeyes had not been out-rebounded in any game that season. But led by Armand Gillian, the six foot nine inch power forward, the Rebels prevented Iowa from getting second and third shots. Gilliam led both teams with 27 points and had 10 rebounds. He said that he became more effective once Patio rediscovered his shooting touch. It was a lot easier for me because it spread things out. Once Gerald started hitting I was real confident we would win. I was style mirror. The Rebels and its zone press forced a turnover as UNLV could not get the ball across midcourt in the allotted 10 seconds. With 22 seconds to play, the Hawkeyes set up for the winning shot, but Campbell's lob pass under the basket to Lojas, hit the backboard and carried out of bounds. The Rebels' Graham was fouled and hit both free throws. The game ended as Campbell's desperation three pointer didn't come anywhere close. It was a miracle the way we came back. Tarcanian said I thought we were living on borrowed time. You just don't come back against a team like that In the final four. Despite Bank setting the three point mark while scoring 38 points and Gilliam's 32 points in a tournament record, 18 assists from Wade UNLV couldn't overcome the Steve Alford led Indiana team. When you're a senior you don't want to end your career like that, said Banks. Being able to play in the final four was a blast because the teammates I played with I was in the zone that night, I think we were overconfident going to that game. 

Speaker 10: 19:48

We were really looking to be in the finals and I don't think we played our best game against Indiana. It was Freddie's senior year. It was my senior year. We were definitely the leaders. They couldn't stop Freddie. 

Speaker 3: 19:57

Banks. There's a three for Banks? 

Speaker 7: 20:01

You kidding me Fading away, going to the deep corner. 

Speaker 6: 20:04

They couldn't stop our McGilliam. 

Speaker 3: 20:06

Gilliam on the turnaround. He's two for two from that spot. 

Speaker 2: 20:09

Now it's Gilliam alone with the three throw line. He'll hammer that shot away. 

Speaker 10: 20:12

Freddie scored 38 points. 

Speaker 3: 20:14

I had 37 points, but Indiana was able to neutralize the other three players on the floor. Adio off the move the three not there, but he misses, he misses very, very badly. 

Speaker 10: 20:26

Kind of a tough game to win when just two guys are scoring. 

Speaker 12: 20:30

Executing its plan to perfection, Indiana beat the Rebels 97-93. 

Speaker 10: 20:37

I really thought we're going to be the national champions that year. That's all we talked about all year long. I was so devastated. 

Speaker 7: 20:44

Not only do I remember the loss to Indiana, I've still never seen Hoosiers. I got on a plane and Hoosiers was playing and I had to put a mask over my eyes. I can never watch that film because I hate that Indiana team so much. 

Speaker 1: 21:00

UNLV's run to the final four in 1987 was one of the most impressive in memory. They were a dominant team that could score points in a variety of ways. Unfortunately for the Rebels, they ran into an Indiana team that played the perfect game and came up short. However, their performance in the tournament was still an iconic moment in UNLV basketball history. 

Speaker 13: 21:18

Tell you what when the records come out on Monday morning, if the Rebels are not the number one team in the nation, I'll eat this red foam thing here, huh. 

Speaker 1: 21:31

We hope that you've enjoyed the storytelling of the 1987 run in Rebels. Now stay tuned for our first person interview with Freddie Banks. 

Speaker 14: 21:42

Las Vegas is growing and it's the 24th city. People don't sleep. 

Speaker 1: 21:45

If you don't sleep, that's on you, but if you don't sleep, so talk a little bit about UNLV and the program in the 80s. How did you end up there to begin with? I know you grew up in Vegas, but how did you get connected with the university there and why did you end up picking it out of the school, the? 

Speaker 14: 22:03

reason why I chose to stay home, because my mother and father are still living. Oh, that's awesome. So for them, they've been married 68 years 16 years, incredible so. I just wanted them to see me for the last four years of my college career and I said you know what? Every school Iowa, nebraska and just name a few was after me. And I said you know what? I'm going to stay home, let my family see me for another 54 years and I'm going to just do what I have to do to make them proud. And I stayed home. Coach Tarr came in to recruit me in my front door, told my mom and dad what he was going to do and he kept his word and I thank him for that. But it was really a treat to play in your hometown people and the Thomas Mac was just being built. I was the first freshman to play in the Thomas Mac. That's awesome. 

Speaker 7: 22:56

And every single game it was sold out every game Best part was the Jaws theme music, the shark roaming around the arena and music. 

Speaker 10: 23:09

Do, do, do, do, do, and he had everybody doing the shark. 

Speaker 7: 23:12

And it was dark and it was really pure Las Vegas show business. 

Speaker 3: 23:15

And then they started Gucci Roll where they put in 72 chairs and they were charged like $2,000 a ticket. 

Speaker 6: 23:22

I got Gucci bags and I filled them with popcorn and everyone on Gucci Roll. I passed out a bag of popcorn with a Gucci bag and that's how come it got the name Gucci. 

Speaker 3: 23:35

Roll. 

Speaker 14: 23:36

We were making more money just off of Gucci Roll and a lot of schools were making out their entire season Amazing, and I was getting people to call me and say, coach, you got a friend, you got a ticket, you got a ticket and I don't have any tickets. I don't have any. So it was amazing. But I really enjoyed what Coach Tart did, even my high school coach, because my high school coach was a excuse. My friends was a ruthless little son of a gun Boy. He did not quit up with any of my men, he didn't care who I was, he just wanted the best of me and I thank him for that too. But it was a great year and everything for me and your nephew. 

Speaker 1: 24:11

So the nickname the Fearless Freddie, because I saw that on the HBC, because we met. Often, like the era of nicknames seems to have everybody's just KD or just a couple of initials. But Fearless Freddie, that's one you want to hang on to. So where did you get that? Did you get that on the playground or somewhere else? 

Speaker 14: 24:29

No, I got that from Coach Tart, actually, coach Tart. Basically we was in Utah State and I think I was a sophomore. No, I was a freshman. I was a freshman at the time and we was playing. We went to triple overtime and they kept following me and kept following me and I go to the line, I make my free throws and we kept staying ahead and staying ahead and then when the game was over, he was so excited he started calling me Fearless Freddie, fearless Freddie. So that stuck with me from this day on. I even had that on my license plate. I'm carrying it on from today. It's a beautiful thing for someone to give you a name that you looked up to as a coach and give you a Fearless Freddie. 

Speaker 1: 25:08

Yeah, that's definitely a mentality thing too, that every coach appreciates. 

Speaker 13: 25:12

Freddie Banks had 38 points in that game. He was 10 of 19 from three-point range. The guy went nuts, freddie. I remember after the game, freddie in the press conference in the group press conference had something to the effect of yeah, I guess I did have a pretty good shooting night. I guess you did Well. 

Speaker 4: 25:31

my shooting was tremendous. I shot the ball. I really shot the ball tonight. You know, it was no question. Everyone was in my face and I was just shooting over. 

Speaker 1: 25:42

Let's talk a little bit about Tark. What did you know about him before he started recruiting you, and how did that perception match up with the reality when you got to know him on a regular basis or interacted with him regularly? 

Speaker 14: 25:55

Well, when I first came encounter with Coach Tark, he came to Valley to watch me play a couple of times and I liked what they was doing. They was running the gun and they was playing defense and that would make me say, you know, I can fit into this kind of system. Here I'm going to stay home. And so when I seen one of my idols who's a local talent guy too matter of fact, it was a few of them, local talents older than me Sutton Sam Smith was 1970s, 77. Michael Spiderman Burns was also in that category when I seen them play and how they was run up down the court, I said, man, I'm going to be one of them. And so back in the 70s, 77, they didn't have three point shooting back then when they was playing and they was averaging over 100 some points. And I said, wow, I know I can shoot long range too. And so I said I'm going to stay home because I know, tark, that you shoot. So I didn't understand home and playing under Danny Tarkin in the first year and in the second year. And he said I'm going to get a host team to you, freddie, and you just run it. And that's what he did, not thinking for it. 

Speaker 12: 26:58

Tark kept coaching. He ignored the internal power struggle and focused on improving his basketball team. He started with two new recruits Armin Gilliam from Pittsburgh and Freddie Banks, a former Las Vegas high school star. 

Speaker 1: 27:12

Stick with the three point shot. How did that impact things at UNLV and fit into the style? Because watching the games it becomes a little hyperbole to think like modern basketball was invented. We'll talk a little bit about that final four game, but man, that looks so modern to this day, just the way that you guys are playing the speed, the pace, just kind of letting it fly, like you said. 

Speaker 14: 27:36

Well, first of all, you have to have a good point guard, and the point guard is the one that can find you in every spot that you go to. My point guard and I still talk to him today Mark Wade. Mark Wade came in when I was a junior and me and him are the best, best friends, so we were roommates. We played in high school against each other and he just knew I was at all times. And then just coming down fast-paced pulling up a three, he just just something that Tark always wanted us to do. He never told me to stop shooting. He always told me you keep shooting. No matter how many you miss, keep shooting, and I loved him for that too. But if you don't have a point guard that can find you behind that three-point line, it's not going to work. But if you can create your own, that's a plus. But I also created my own also, but if you didn't get close to me, it was going up quickly and fast. 

Speaker 1: 28:31

You're that neon green light from talking. That's nice. That is a that does help a shooter. I think the mentality I often see like the best shooting teams have a coach that understands that shooters can get hot and cold, and if you're you know, they've seen you enough in practice to know, like this guy, if he misses a couple, the next one's going in and just to foster that mentality. 

Speaker 14: 28:54

Well, it's a lot of work too, also because you know you got to stay in the gym and I was always in the gym early in the morning, didn't come in to practice shoot some more. You got to put up in and Kobe Bryant said the best you putting up 500s of a thousand shots. That's a lot of shots putting up, but you're getting your work in and I encourage all the young people out there. That's how all my shots was falling, because I was using my legs and my arm. 

Speaker 1: 29:19

I think one of the most underrated things in basketball is how teammates fit on and off the court. And you mentioned Wade, but how did the? What was the vibe like with the rest of the team? Were you guys close? 

Speaker 14: 29:29

or especially that 87, that 86, 87 campaign, wow, and you know, we, we was like brothers, we, we basically didn't know what we was doing in the 87 year and that was our senior year. We didn't know what we know. We just all said we just want to make to the final four. And once we got there, we didn't know what we was doing. But we did get there, but we was all brothers. We spent time together, we ate together, we played together. Anything at the university we've done, we did, and from this day I keep up with Eldridge Hudson, jarvis Bassknight, gary Graham, armand Gillan Rest in Peace because he passed away Mark Wade, jero Patio. I keep in contact with every one of my teammates as of today. 

Speaker 1: 30:15

I think that's such a special thing and you know, we see in modern basketball a lot of teams put together, even like in the AAU circuit, a lot of guys just are pulled together and you know you, you see the talent and obviously that wins out in a lot of situations. But the NCAA tournament is a weird thing. I think you hit on it with Wade Like he knew where you were. That comes from playing together too, like not just from being a good point guard. But that's like I know where you're, you like the ball, I know where you like to shoot from and that you're going to go to. Even unconsciously, you know, and I think that's so important for basketball players. 

Speaker 14: 30:49

Yes, it is, and, like I said, he he knows why I'm coming because he's always looked back and he knows I was coming and he just handed it off to me or he just do it to me one, two, so he knows me very well yeah. 

Speaker 1: 31:00

So you said you had the goal of the final four. Was that a team goal that you guys put together or coaches? 

Speaker 14: 31:05

No, it wasn't a goal at all. I mean, we just played hard and because you know we was one, we was undefeated until we played Oklahoma and Indiana. 37 and two was a very good record. We could have went 40 and 0, but you know, unfortunately we didn't. We didn't come up, came up short. But the thing is that the, the guys that we played, we just practice hard, we beat up on each other, we fought each other and we made each other better and that's what, what we did. But when we got to the final four, we were so happy that we beat Iowa because we were down by almost 20. Well, it was, it was a lot. I mean, at the Superdome, I think they, the record was 64,000 people. I think it was yeah, something like that. 

Speaker 1: 31:51

Yeah, it was a lot. 

Speaker 14: 31:51

Yeah, it was a lot. And so we, we are used to playing at 20 to 30 and sometimes in Mac. It's a crap, man, but it was, it was fun. I mean I have no bad feelings from the time we was at the Superdome or anything like that. And once we beat Iowa we said oh man, we're here. So you know, going a little early to the final four, and in 87, I think it kind of opened our eyes a little bit, because you know you're on Bourbon Street in New Orleans, man, you don't want to have your good time, and I think we, I think we kind of party too much. 

Speaker 13: 32:24

March 1987, Rebels in New Orleans taken on Indiana, New Orleans, it was fun. I did all the regular voodoo stories. I did all the crawdad stories, crawfish. We did a crawfish bake with Gary Graham and Armageddian. I remember Tark had no curfew for his guys, he just said he didn't do it. He didn't have a curfew. Indiana was real tight curfew. Tark said he didn't do it all season. So why do it now? It's one o'clock in the morning, the night, the day of the game. So it was the morning and it was that night. I remember seeing David Willard down in Alleyway and he was relieving himself and had a had a hurricane, a large drink in his hand, and so I looked at him, smiled and said, hey, get ready for tomorrow. 

Speaker 1: 33:11

Amazing, amazing. Yeah, I talked to Hillman and that was one of the things that he said that coach Knight did was that he wouldn't, wouldn't take them down there. He like took them down there at the last, very last minute and then, they stayed outside of the state, outside of the city, prior to the final four games. That's interesting. It sure didn't look like it slowed you guys down in that game. I'll have to, I have to say, if you were going to go even faster than that you guys did, we're moving pretty well. 

Speaker 14: 33:37

Where we was, we did move pretty fast, but but again, we usually have at least two to three people score as many as 10 points and we didn't have that at all. All the guys scored below 10. We looked at to them to get over 10 because we and I'm losing to Indiana by four, because I right now I hold the record as most threes and Mark Ray Ruckett just got beat the other week. Yeah, and Armand and I both Try to hold the team together because I finished with 38, he finished with 34 and so we just didn't come up. We came on short because the guys that we did see to score points was drill patio or Elger Huston or George Bassnate, and they all came on short. Yeah, all right. 

Speaker 1: 34:22

Give me a, give me a Tark story from that that 86-87, because I'm always curious how he pushes. You know, great coaches like him push players after wins and losses and you never. 

Speaker 14: 34:32

You guys never lost well, it wasn't more of so of we thought we was gonna win. We just knew that once we get on the court it's time to play basketball. It was like almost a business to all of us because the next level was some of us to make it to the pro level. But when we got on the court and listen to Tark Tark, he let us be ourself. But we always would tip my head off to Tim Gerrach, who was assistant coach, and he always went to coach Gerrach on everything that you know supposed to do on the court or off the court. He always went to coach Gerrach. But Tark kind of subbed us in and out. So we did a good job when he came in and out of the game each one of us. But his story is it's unbelievable. I mean, he just go out to get the inner city kids. He didn't go out to get the diaper den kind of kids. He would not get the inner city kids to play for him and those interested kids didn't have a chance to make it to anyone else. So he gave all of them a chance to play. I didn't have too many inner city kids with me yeah, plan when the years I was playing, but I had a great group of kids that played with me, like Gary Graham for playing for Dunbar, george Bassnate was in California playing I forgot the name of his school and Mark way. So it's a number of those guys. Elger Hudson, you know, he was the next Magic Johnson until you told me CLO. So I played with some good guys, but not no, no, no, you know those kids that he really, really gave everybody opportunity to play. 

Speaker 1: 35:59

What was it day in the life of a UNLV running revel then like? What was your guys day like now? Because it's it seems like the it's changed so much. You know they have like our rules in for for college players, but what was it like for for you guys at that at that time? 

Speaker 14: 36:14

Well, you know, the NCAA was so tight on everything and we couldn't do too much of anything. But as a, as a young man coming in from Miles, miles away, it was kind of hard for them to survive. We all got our scholarship checks and different things like that. But now days, they giving them scholarship check, they giving them a tuition kind of money, they give them so much money they don't even have to go to probes. Today they're paying them, yeah, and so we didn't get that. If you got paid any type of money, it was under the table and no one knew. And so now you gotta do all that. They just giving it to you and nothing happened. But the NCAA was really, really bad in those days because of a coasttart, he'd been fighting for the against the NCAA for a Christ in time and won his case. But now you know it was. It's bad, but the kids are different kids now. Yeah, I see it, and they fight me as, as you know, as a coach that's been there and I'm like I would not and I would not put my name on you. If you I'm, do I tell you to do? 

Speaker 3: 37:15

We're allowing them to throw the ball. Where do you want the night and next pass? 

Speaker 1: 37:19

All right. So you guys start out 15 and oh, you're ranked number one in the country and you go into that Oklahoma game. What sticks out to you about that first loss of the season? How did that play out inside the locker room? 

Speaker 14: 37:32

Well, you know what, be honest with you, all we did was we went to the locker room. We all Visualized the what had happened. Gary Graham shot the three it was actually a three, they call it a two and then, if we would Because I think we end up losing by two did Oklahoma, and so we didn't hold our heads down. We knew we. That loss kind of helped us, because when you lose a game it just bring the commodity of your team together, yeah, closer. And that's what it did to us, because that's the day we didn't lose any more games. We went straight through the the tournament in different things and in our bracket, and then we went to the final four and we just stayed together because we should have had not made it to the final four with Iowa go, go there. 

Speaker 1: 38:15

Yeah, so you go. You get to that Iowa team. Seven eventual pros on that Iowa team. I think people might not hear Iowa and proteins, but they had BJ Armstrong who played with Jordan. You guys are down 16 at at half. Yes, what in the world? How'd you guys come out on top? 

Speaker 14: 38:31

Well, well, we went into the locker room. You know normally coach Tucker coming in locker room, he is scream here, he has his boots on here, kick the wall. He's told a chalk. He didn't say anything, he said. He said, gentlemen, he said this is on your court. You know what you got to do to come back, wow. So before that, before that even happened, I spoke to Roy Marble. I think it was where Marble, kevin Gammon, one of them, and I was shooting. Well, and I told them in half time I say you know what I'll be back like on a small snake, I'll be back. So Once drill paddow hit his first three, that opened the door for me to hit mines. And we just fought our way back and you know, beating them by what would be. I can't remember what we beat, I would buy, but we in them coming back and beating them down by 20. And that was the first bit come back we had, since I've been playing at Yonah V. 

Speaker 1: 39:18

Yes, what was the prep for, though? Let's go back a little bit. What was the prep for that? The NCAA tournament, like the you know Going because, you've had this amazing season now, so you might not have been thinking championship or final four at the beginning of the season, but surely you know, going into that you had to at least have some, some aspirations for it. 

Speaker 14: 39:37

Well, yeah, we did. We all had aspirations for getting to the final four, but once we got there, we were like, wow, we're here now, so what we gonna do? The Jarvis back not brought it to our attention, he said. He said, fred, I didn't know what to do because it was the all the lights and the cameras and the people and all the people. You see it, it just you know, even though we're in Vegas, we don't get out like that, yeah, in the city of Las Vegas to see all the lights. But when you see all that, you like, wow, this is really the final four. And so all the guys was, you know, not paranoid, but they was excited, they was, they was on their own, we were doing what we like to do and that's party together and enjoy our life and just play basketball. 

Speaker 1: 40:18

The week leading up to the final four in New Orleans. Walk me through it. When did you guys get there? What was? What was coach Tark talking about? About this Hoosiers team, like what did? 

Speaker 13: 40:26

what did you guys think about him before, before the game Some people see this game as a battle of the good boys against the bad. 

Speaker 8: 40:34

I'm not like him doing things for nothing. I'm gonna do an interview. You're gonna show my book to the Vegas people because I read about you, boy twerk. Just go, people buy it. Go ahead. What do you want? I happen to have a book. This matchup, what I think you're looking at two of the better basketball teams in America. Talent lies. We got two coaches that are considered to be two of the Rose races. We have a defensive specialist interesting matchup Bobby Nights Indiana. 

Speaker 13: 40:58

Hoosiers took the court first and Steve offered couldn't miss out there. Rebels are hoping he spends more time running than shooting tomorrow. 

Speaker 15: 41:04

He's one of the best players in the nation and what they do, their whole office is geared for getting him open. You know it's gonna be tough for me, gary and Fred to stay with him because we're gonna be getting picked. You know, every time we turn around, the defense is habitual with this. Right now I think it's real repetitious in ways that we don't have to, we don't, we don't have to guess. I mean, it comes natural that I don't really believe anybody's gonna stop the alpha. 

Speaker 3: 41:25

We just hope that we can keep him under control and keep him you know where. He doesn't just have an unbelievable night. You're not gonna stop him. 

Speaker 14: 41:33

Well, we he didn't really talked about the Hoosier team at all. We just know that they have Steve offer, which is the player, and we just concentrate on what he does on the court and how he gets his shots old off and then different things like that. We just prepare for them for a whole week or two and then we just y'all are playing and flew up the Orleans and just Did our game plan. The game plan was to stop him and Hold everybody else to whatever we can hold them to, but the plan was didn't happen as much as that we wanted to. He still got his 30, some points, but the rest of them just made free throws down the line. So when you file someone, you go to the line and make it free throw. That's a good thing. You mentioned Two of the guys, so, kate, things name now. 

Speaker 1: 42:21

I'm in Joe Hill yeah okay and play well. 

Speaker 14: 42:25

I can't think of a guy named either 69 Powerful to. He came in, play well and that was they boost right there. Those two guys really came in and play well for them and we had no answer to those two Because I think Joe was guarding me and that was a mistake, because he's. What was a mistake too? Because I think Bobby Knight was, you know, getting kind of frustrated because there was no answer to how to stop me in the game, not saying that I was better than anyone else on the court. 

Speaker 1: 42:55

I mean that night. That night you were, I would say that I. 

Speaker 14: 43:00

Was just trying to make sure I stayed one more night to finish up my college career and it was. It was wonderful. I mean, they play well, they end up beating us by four, but you know, and then they wouldn't. What makes it even special is Losing the game and they went on to win the next championship. Yeah, that makes it a special thing, because they beat us and then went to one and the whole thing from the Indiana side. 

Speaker 1: 43:24

They kind of tell the the story. Like you know, Indiana isn't traditionally like a running gun team and they had decided to like adopt that style to kind of surprise you guys. Were you surprised by them coming out with at like kind of matching your pace. 

Speaker 14: 43:38

Well, they, they tried to match the pace but they kind of slowed it down. Because Bobby Knight knows that all we like to do is to get up and down the court fast and then shoot the first, first open shot. So they, they did run a couple times when the opportunity was there for them to run, but they also slowed down because if they slow it down that makes us staggered where we don't know, just stay in our stands or pressure the ball and things like that. So it made a big difference when we played them because they slowed us down a little bit. 

Speaker 1: 44:06

All right, tell me about what it was like to be that hot in a final four game, because you ended up with what? Ten threes in that game. 

Speaker 14: 44:12

Well, it was fun. I mean, like I said, mark mark way found me a lot on the court. Once I got my first shot off, I said, oh, this is gonna be a very good night for me, because when you have your family in the stands and you don't know where they sit, there, but they there yeah. And you want to perform your well because this is your senior and you have all the scouts up there watching and Things, so you want to make sure you put on a good performance. So a lot of those points tonight. The issue the three I created on my own because I'm floating to the baseline. I fall away from the baseline. I wide open shot, or you just had your hand down, like mark Jackson, you should tell your hand down, man down. So yeah, so a lot of them put their hands up. So once I lift up and let my shot go it was, I Consider it's going in. 

Speaker 1: 44:59

Even now watching it, I can almost believe that you guys might beat Indiana. Just how hot you were every time you you put the ball up, no matter if you're drifting or set ball is pure, leaving your hand. Really amazing performance. 

Speaker 14: 45:12

Yes, it was thank you, but I think at nine time out of ten, I think if we played them again it'll be something different. 

Speaker 1: 45:20

Yeah, I don't think you're wrong. Both of those teams are at an elite level of basketball that you you can't see, accepting the Best situations. Both of those teams could have played anybody else, I think, and and beat them on any any night. 

Speaker 14: 45:33

Right, well, it was a lot of red in the gym. 

Speaker 1: 45:39

Lotta lotta yes okay, oh, I gotta. I had to ask you what. There's a scene that they always show that you guys come out at Half-time late from the locker rooms. You see Tark running across you know Cuz you're in the Superdome, this giant stadium, and he's like running from the locker room. The announcers say that Bobby Knight's like trying to get the game started because you guys are late getting out. So what in the world happened? 

Speaker 14: 46:03

Well, normally they come in and they'll tell us hey, you got so much time left on the clock and you need to get out, and so no one did that, and that the Orleans is a huge, huge place and that's half what you see out there. That was just half of them exactly we had to. Once the, you know, everybody say, hey, you're the there at the clock is about to start in game about to start. So Tark had to run. I'm running to get to this, I'm getting some, you know, get my legs back on to me because I've been sitting so long, and that that's basically what happened. No one came to sit and think about us, about the clock, and we're trying to get back, you know, to the court that is never happen anymore. 

Speaker 1: 46:47

Just amazing, that happened. Just like a fun little little fact. Watching the game to him, just like watching Tark jog out there Doesn't look like he did a lot running. 

Speaker 14: 46:57

Yeah, he did, I think. When he got back, I think he grabbed his towel to you know, chop it on his. I bet a lot of folks always ask me what? What is why he always sucking on the towel? Yeah. And the reason is that the story he told me is because when he's yelling, his mouth gets dry, and when he's is watering in one towel, in the other towel it's really dry. So all he does is suck the water out of the keepers, don't force. So that's what's in, why he killed it. Huh. 

Speaker 1: 47:29

That's amazing. I don't think I've ever heard that word. That's great. 

Speaker 14: 47:31

No, no, no, no, no, no, no story. But I know the story because he told me. 

Speaker 12: 47:37

Like most headliners in Las Vegas, tark had a schtick a meticulously folded, slightly moistened towel, occasionally placed under his seat but more often found in his mouth. You always look really funny biting on the towel. That's where you got the nickname bulldog bulldog always. He grabs the towel, starts shaking. 

Speaker 11: 47:59

You would always prepare his towels. I guess he would soak one and have one dry. 

Speaker 3: 48:04

Nobody else can wet it exactly the way he does it it's never too wet, it's never too dry and he folds them perfectly. 

Speaker 10: 48:11

I guess it worked for me. One over 82% of his games. 

Speaker 1: 48:15

Okay, so take Unfortunately, of course Indiana. For you guys, indiana wins. Take me into the locker room afterwards. What was the mood or feeling? Certainly had a lot to celebrate, but those are tough losses too. 

Speaker 14: 48:27

Yeah, it was a tough loss. After the game was over, where we all went to the locker room and just, you know, just hold our heads down a little bit, because you know, you're a young man, you don't, you don't like losing. Especially the caliber team that we had, we didn't want to lose. So most of us had a head up, most of had a heads down. I think I had my head down because it was A performance that I never did before and it helped me out as far as my draft pick in the NBA. But I told them they asked me what are you going to do? Are you going to stay here for the Champions again or you go home? I said no, y'all give me a playing ticket the first time out I'm going home. So I ended up going home early. My family was left behind. So I got home and I just thought about all the Good things and I thought about the bad things that in my university career but most of it was mostly good things since I've been at university- that's great. 

Speaker 1: 49:18

Who are you cheering for in the if I gave you true serum in the championship games? 

Speaker 14: 49:22

I was cheering for Syracuse, you know I was. I would have done the same. We really got two of all of us, yeah, but it was fine, it was really fun. 

Speaker 3: 49:38

I thought we had a pretty good plan to stop and it sure didn't work. You know, we, we felt like we were going to do a better job on him. I, we didn't do a good job. We didn't do nearly as good a job on him as we had hoped we would. That we could do. 

Speaker 15: 49:51

We just didn't have the defensive attention we normally do and that's what caused his problems late in the game. You know, they got, they executed. They got the ball of Steve Hoffman they needed to and he converted. 

Speaker 10: 49:59

I look back on this year and we have a lot of good memories. We played well, but the thing is, we could have won this game today. That's really what, harrison, that's what we have to live with. 

Speaker 4: 50:07

It's really been a great season for us. We can't complain about it. We just just didn't sell out hard enough to get this and we just gonna miss coach Tarkin and all the rest of the assistant coach. But we just came up short at the at the end. 

Speaker 15: 50:18

We've been together. We're still gonna be together. You know, we just didn't have it today. You know I mean there's no one, what you didn't see, no one. You know in here all the manner or anything. You know we had a great year. You know we had a great year. You know, and you know I like to say something going back to Vegas. I like to say thank you very much to our fans, you know, and for all those who came and all those who couldn't make it, you know thank you very much and for me I love you a lot and I know the team feel the same way about it I like to say thank you. 

Speaker 3: 50:43

Wherever our kids go. That's the talk of the town. It was more difficult to get a ticket to a UNLV basketball game than it was to the Frank Sinatra show. 

Speaker 1: 50:55

Thank you for joining us for this look back at the 1987 UNLV running Rebels. My iconic seasons is a principal podcast production. I'm your host and executive producer, aaron Meyer. Special thanks to all our guests for sharing their journeys. If you enjoy this series, head over to Apple Podcasts, spotify, youtube or wherever you get your podcasts and follow the show, and make sure to leave us a rating and review. It helps us out and helps others to discover the show. If you're interested in a bonus episode, send us your questions via email. Our email address is hardwoodhistorycom. Thanks again for listening. We'll be back with episode 7, telling the story of the 1987 Hoosiers and featuring our first of three interviews with Joe Hillman.